11/09 Top-10 Cartridge Based Handheld Games

[GameGavel]

In our November 2009 podcast we tackle the Top-10 Cartridge Based Handheld Games. How did we rate? What did we completely forget about? Chime in and let us know.


And, don't forget to VOTE!

[BydoEmpire73]

I don't see how I could vote for anything but Tetris, but I'm going to wait until I hear all the arguments...

[retrocollect-2008]

I'm with Bydo, Tetris must be the number one pick. Not only the greatest handheld cart but probably the greatest pack in game of all time. One of the few games that I can remember dreaming about - Playing the damn thing in my sleep over and over again.


Marioland was also great, all that platformy goodness in a handheld and just when you get used to running and jumping it throws in a "shoot 'em up" level as well. Excellent. It's still as enjoyable today - Although I must say it seems to have gotten a lot easier as I've got older.

Zelda: Link's Awakening is fantastic too I still can't believe how they managed to cram in a full blown RPG into the little grey brick it even rivals the SNES version (although not quite there) but the story made me keep playing till i completed it.

Theres probably more i can think off but off to grab the show and have a listen first

[CinemaslaveJoe]

Just curious: am I the only person in the world who thinks TETRIS is overrated? I don't hate it certainly, but I just don't get the mass adulation. To me it's a fun but average game. (It doesn't touch KLAX, for instance.)

Just me?

-CSJ

[miner2049er]

Just me?

I doubt it, but you must be in a small minority.

Not many other games or even genres are so universally liked. Resident Evil is popular but some people hate the genre, Halo sells millions but I'm not a big fan.

Puzzlers are almost without exception popular in general.

[BydoEmpire73]

Activision Anthology was really, really well done. It was permanently in the GBA-slot of my original DS, and is a great pick. Definitely deserves to be up there.

[Chewchilla]

I loved playing Klax on the Lynx. It was definitely my most played Lynx game. One of the best arcade to portable game system conversions.

[GameGavel]

Activision Anthology was really, really well done. It was permanently in the GBA-slot of my original DS, and is a great pick. Definitely deserves to be up there.

Thanks. As I thought I wouldn't be the only one thinking this should be in there. It still amazes me they stuffed all those great games on one cart. Gotta love techonology :)

[GameGavel]

Thanks to Scott, I am bidding on this:

http://www.gamegavel.com/item.cgi?show_item=0000228265

[Troglodyte]

Thanks to Scott, I am bidding on this:

Awesome... that is my duplicate copy that I am selling
Hopefully, you end up the winner.

Anyway, it seems maybe that you have never played Metroid II: Return of Samus?

In my opinion, it is better than the :NES version of Metroid, but the best version of Metroid was Super Metroid :SAM: (also known as Metroid 3), and unfortunatly does not diserve to be in this Top-10 list. Perhaps it would have a place in a Top-20, or Top-30 list. Certaintly not anything less than that though as it is a good game (if not a little directionally confusing, like the original Metroid).

As far as I am concerned, Tetris is obviously number one... The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening should be second. In my opinion, it is even better than the :SNES:SNES version of The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past.

However, Super Mario Land 2: 6 Golden Coins should also be in there as discussed. Wario Land: Super Mario Land 3 should also be in there. In my opinion, it is one of the best Wario games, and should be placed above Super Mario Land 2.

[Chris]

Ok I haven't finished the Top 10 from this month and I'm not reading any posts in this thread so as not to spoil it. But how in the name of all things holy can Activision Anthology be put at #10!?!?! That is definitely a fantastic GBA game. The presentation with the Atari cartridge rack, the ability to unlock the badges, the perfectly emulated Activision classics, the scans of the boxart and manuals and instructions (!), it's a FANTASTIC cart.

People do these arcade compilations all the time and they suck, I think this one deserves to be top 5 at least. I still play it on my Retro NES GBA :SM.

[GameGavel]

Ok I haven't finished the Top 10 from this month and I'm not reading any posts in this thread so as not to spoil it. But how in the name of all things holy can Activision Anthology be put at #10!?!?! That is definitely a fantastic GBA game. The presentation with the Atari cartridge rack, the ability to unlock the badges, the perfectly emulated Activision classics, the scans of the boxart and manuals and instructions (!), it's a FANTASTIC cart.

People do these arcade compilations all the time and they suck, I think this one deserves to be top 5 at least. I still play it on my Retro NES GBA :SM.

I agree! My co-hosts are Morons :BW:

Do you have the Retro NES GBA SP? Me too! It's pretty sweet.

[SubaruBrat]

I have voted for these games in the past, I will vote for them again in their console, arcade, handheld and even boardgame renditions. I just want to see other games get a shot they deserve.

[GameGavel]

I have voted for these games in the past, I will vote for them again in their console, arcade, handheld and even boardgame renditions. I just want to see other games get a shot they deserve.

:LALA::POK:BLEH::Blah::CRAZY:

[Troglodyte]

Do you have the Retro NES GBA SP? Me too! It's pretty sweet.

I want to get the Retro NES GBA SP as well as the Retro Famicom version, someday too.

Does anyone know if either of these systems are the second re-released versions (with the ability to turn the backlight on and off?).

The only thing I hate about the GBA SPs is that it doesn't have a standard headphone port built-in (you have to use a stupid cumbersome official Nintendo adapter :CHOC). The system is dying to be modded; if only for this fact.

[Chris]

I agree! My co-hosts are Morons :BW:

Do you have the Retro NES GBA SP? Me too! It's pretty sweet.

Yeah, it's the only GBA SP that I've kept. I don't like the outside design as much, but the inside is fantastic (especially with the textured surface that feels just like the NES pad).

I think you and I were the same with Activision Anthology (I just got done listening to the top 10). I was just so amped up when that game came out and I'm not that great of a game player but I've managed to surprise myself and get a fair number of badges. What's great is I discovered games on that anthology that I never had the chance to play, like Barnstormer and River Raid.

Just pouring over the old scans is great too. I really want to see something like this on the DS too. I know you can play it on the DS, but I found that the stronger backlit screen of the DS washed out the colors or something.

Hey did you catch the Alex Kidd review I did on Video Masters TV?

[miner2049er]

Hey did you catch the Alex Kidd review I did on Video Masters TV?

Sure did.

Has John told you what I sent him for the show?

[Chris]

Sure did.

Has John told you what I sent him for the show?

No he didn't, is it top secret?

[Chris]

I wouldn't recommend the original NES Zelda. In my book, the only two Zelda's that matter are A Link to the Past and Ocarina of Time. Both titles are just masterpieces. The scope and scale of Ocarina was pretty amazing for its time.

My least favorite Zelda ever was Majora's Mask. I was a broke college student when Majora's Mask came out, but I had to have it fresh off the heels of Ocarina. I sold almost my entire Queen CD collection at a pawn shop so I could buy Majora's Mask. One of my biggest gaming-related mistakes ever.

As a person who extensively played Super Mario Land AND Super Mario Land 2, there's no doubt that 6 Golden Coins is the one that should be in the top 10 between those two titles. Scott said it best when he used the word "novel" to describe SML, that's exactly what it was. I looked past the ghosting because it was a portable Mario game, but for me it doesn't age well. 6 Golden Coins was more like what the first one should have been.

[BydoEmpire73]

The thing with Activision Anthology on GBA is that it's more than just a collection of emulated games. It had the unlockable patches if you beat the real scores required to get the patch back in the day. That's the coolest feature I've ever seen in any emulation compilation. It also just worked so well as a handheld game.

[TV's Mr. Neil]

Here's the problem I have. For a portable gaming top ten list, you should have been considering either the impact that these games had on the portable genre and the impact that being ported to a handheld had on a game.

For example, Tetris may not have been originally made for a handheld system, but that's where it made its mark. Tetris etched itself into history, thanks the to the Gameboy. And the Gameboy owes its success to Tetris. Tetris is the the quintenessential portable game. that's where it made its biggest impact.

This Activision collection, however, is comprised of a bunch of games that made their impact on the Atari, which is a console designed to be played on a television. I think what you tried to do was to take your nostalgia for the 2600 and smuggle it into a portable debate, which I think is unfair.

Activision Anthology may be a fantastic collection, and I would love to own it some day, but it is not even close to being the sort of title I would even consider for such a list.

There are lots of games that I love that have been ported to portable consoles that I would never put on a top ten list of portable games, because these games belong in among console-based debates. Portables should be given props for its own innovations and not simply piggybacking the successes of yesterday's consoles via emulation.

So in other words, So Cal, leave your Atari love out of the handheld debate.

:X::AT

[GameGavel]

But it was my top-10 list and I vote them in on the impact they had in my life :)

Everyone has to remember, our top-10s aren't necessarily the top-10's you would see published in some retro mag or video game website that mindlessly picks out the most obvious top-10s. These are our top-10s and are personal picks. That is what makes our top-10 debates fun to listen to. I see top-10s all over the place and sometimes they are nearly identical. Noone wants to keep seeing or hearing about the same top-10 picks over and over again, so some personal picks mix things up a bit.

And Activision Anthology is a great handheld game that is perfectly made for a handheld system. As was mentioned earlier, it is probably one of the best, if not the best, compilation out there. And to be able to play it on a handheld is even more impressive. If I were stranded on a desert island I can comfortable say I would rather have that cart than nearly any of the other carts in our top-10. There is more variety stuffed on that one cart than any other. But I suppose you would have had to grow up loving the Activision titles to begin with.

Klax was a port. Tetris was a port. SMB DX was a port. If we can't include ports in our lists, we will leave out alot of legitimate choices in future lists I think.

[TV's Mr. Neil]

I wouldn't put Klax or Mario DX in there, either. Klax is a game I remember from the Genesis and, to a lesser extent, the arcade. By the time it came out on GBC, it was old news. And Mario DX... well... I don't even have to explain that. It's an NES game.

But Tetris is different. Tetris may be a port, but it's a game that made it's mark on a portable system. And for that reason, it is THE portable game. I don't really care whether or not a game is made for a portable system. That's not my exact criteria. I'm looking at it from the game's impact in gaming history.

There was just way too much Mario flying around this list, anyway. I would have picked one of the Super Mario Land titles and left it at that. You guys should have a one-game-per-franchise rule.

Also, why was UK Mike referring to Super Mario Land 2 as Super Mario Bros. 2? Luigi isn't in that game.

[SubaruBrat]

Everyone has to remember, our top-10s aren't necessarily the top-10's you would see published in some retro mag or video game website that mindlessly picks out the most obvious top-10s. These are our top-10s and are personal picks. That is what makes our top-10 debates fun to listen to. I see top-10s all over the place and sometimes they are nearly identical. Noone wants to keep seeing or hearing about the same top-10 picks over and over again, so some personal picks mix things up a bit.

Right on, but it is clear that mine is more correct...

[GameGavel]

I wouldn't put Klax or Mario DX in there, either. Klax is a game I remember from the Genesis and, to a lesser extent, the arcade. By the time it came out on GBC, it was old news. And Mario DX... well... I don't even have to explain that. It's an NES game.

But Tetris is different. Tetris may be a port, but it's a game that made it's mark on a portable system. And for that reason, it is THE portable game. I don't really care whether or not a game is made for a portable system. That's not my exact criteria. I'm looking at it from the game's impact in gaming history.

There was just way too much Mario flying around this list, anyway. I would have picked one of the Super Mario Land titles and left it at that. You guys should have a one-game-per-franchise rule.

Also, why was UK Mike referring to Super Mario Land 2 as Super Mario Bros. 2? Luigi isn't in that game.

Out of curiousity what would your top-10 list include? Love to hear your picks. Then drill down your top-10 to four only and you will see what we go through. Picking just four games out of so many is difficult. Also, I do see what you are saying about Tetris but can you pick 15 other games with as much significance as that one?

[BydoEmpire73]

For me, it's not always about making a mark on gaming history. It's not a top 10 of "most historically significant games." Sometimes a game that's just so darn good, or has made it's mark on you personally deserves the recognition.

[TV's Mr. Neil]

Historical significance isn't my sole criteria. If I did, I would put Pokemon at #1, with the way that it changed the way developers thought of using linked gameplay. I just can't put Pokemon on any such list.

I do have my sentimental favorites. I just have a problem putting games from earlier platforms into a portable top ten, unless being put on the portable system made a significant difference for the game (i.e., Tetris). There are games like this that were originally on consoles or computers that just feel much better on a handheld. But not many, in my opinion.

My point on setting certain standards is that I feel that console ports on a list of handheld games can kind of dilute the list. In the same respect, I would never put Genesis or Turbo Grafx games on the list just because the Nomad and Turbo Express made those games portable.

My list would be more portable-centric, is what I'm saying.


Out of curiousity what would your top-10 list include? Love to hear your picks. Then drill down your top-10 to four only and you will see what we go through. Picking just four games out of so many is difficult. Also, I do see what you are saying about Tetris but can you pick 15 other games with as much significance as that one?

I'll give you more than a top four. I'll give you my personal top ten. Although, my top four picks are indeed the four I'd bring to the table.

As I said, I'm not using platform significance as my sole criteria, otherwise I'd have to put Pokemon on my list, and I have an extreme aversion to that. My picks are basically games that are in their element on the portable consoles and nowhere else.

And so...

1. Tetris
It's hard not to make the number 1 game Tetris. It's my opinion that this is actually the greatest video game of all time. It may not be the most popular or best selling, but it's the most universal, from what I've seen. And it's been a staple of portable gaming ever since 1987.

2. Donkey Kong '94
HA! I veto ALL of your Mario choices and substitute this awesome game instead! I was so sad that this game was absent from your list. It's actually a fairly lengthy platformer that expands significantly upon the original game. It's kind of a weird mix of the Donkey Kong play style and the pick-up-and-throw style of Super Mario 2.

3. Sonic Pocket Adventure
Another mascot-based veto. Skip the Game Gear. This list needs a little Neo Geo Pocket power! Sonic returns to form at long last with this awesome portable game. The follow-up GBA title was also good, but I'm not listing it here. I don't particularly like the Game Gear titles at all, actually.

4. Golden Sun
One of only two RPGs I'm putting on my list, and the only one I'm putting in my top four. Why? Because most of the portable RPGs that I know of are ports of SNES and Genesis titles. Golden Sun was just awesome and so huge that they had to release it on two carts. It's also an original IP.

5. Zelda: Link's Awakening
My favorite Zelda. Best of what I liked about the NES and SNES titles, plus it finally let you swap the sword for another weapon. A bit more light-hearted, too. And it showed me that the Gameboy could do a game of this caliber. Before this game, I didn't know that the Gameboy could do this kind of adventure. Color version is even better.

6. Wario Ware Twisted
Pretty much covered in the episode. Cool innovation.

7. Metroid Zero Mission
Probably my most controversial pick, since it's a remake of a console game, and I don't like putting console games in my portables list. But it isn't just a retread, either. New bosses, new areas, and new surprises everywhere. Probably the best of the 2-D Metroids.

8. Final Fantasy Adventure
The first Zelda-style game on the original Gameboy. Not at all like the regular series. Kind of went under the radar for a while until people started realizing that it was the predecessor to the Secret Of Mana.

9. Defenders of Oasis
My other hardcore RPG choice, and my only Game Gear pick. I don't look upon Game Gear fondly, but this was pretty good.

10. SNK Gal Fighter
because it's awesome, and Neo Geo Pocket deserves love.

A few other honorable mentions: TMNT: Fall of the Foot Clan, Final Fantasy Tactics Advance, most any portable Zelda, Castlevania Aria Of Sorrow, Final Fantasy Legend II, Wade Hixton's Counter Punch, the Wario Land series, Sonic Advance, Advance Wars, Kirby's Dreamland 2, and Super Mario Land.

Tried to keep it varied, but there isn't much outside of a Nintendo portable that I can truly say I enjoyed. Game Gear especially.

[GameGavel]

Historical significance isn't my sole criteria. If I did, I would put Pokemon at #1, with the way that it changed the way developers thought of using linked gameplay. I just can't put Pokemon on any such list.

I do have my sentimental favorites. I just have a problem putting games from earlier platforms into a portable top ten, unless being put on the portable system made a significant difference for the game (i.e., Tetris). There are games like this that were originally on consoles or computers that just feel much better on a handheld. But not many, in my opinion.

My point on setting certain standards is that I feel that console ports on a list of handheld games can kind of dilute the list. In the same respect, I would never put Genesis or Turbo Grafx games on the list just because the Nomad and Turbo Express made those games portable.

My list would be more portable-centric, is what I'm saying.



I'll give you more than a top four. I'll give you my personal top ten. Although, my top four picks are indeed the four I'd bring to the table.

As I said, I'm not using platform significance as my sole criteria, otherwise I'd have to put Pokemon on my list, and I have an extreme aversion to that. My picks are basically games that are in their element on the portable consoles and nowhere else.

And so...

1. Tetris
It's hard not to make the number 1 game Tetris. It's my opinion that this is actually the greatest video game of all time. It may not be the most popular or best selling, but it's the most universal, from what I've seen. And it's been a staple of portable gaming ever since 1987.

2. Donkey Kong '94
HA! I veto ALL of your Mario choices and substitute this awesome game instead! I was so sad that this game was absent from your list. It's actually a fairly lengthy platformer that expands significantly upon the original game. It's kind of a weird mix of the Donkey Kong play style and the pick-up-and-throw style of Super Mario 2.

3. Sonic Pocket Adventure
Another mascot-based veto. Skip the Game Gear. This list needs a little Neo Geo Pocket power! Sonic returns to form at long last with this awesome portable game. The follow-up GBA title was also good, but I'm not listing it here. I don't particularly like the Game Gear titles at all, actually.

4. Golden Sun
One of only two RPGs I'm putting on my list, and the only one I'm putting in my top four. Why? Because most of the portable RPGs that I know of are ports of SNES and Genesis titles. Golden Sun was just awesome and so huge that they had to release it on two carts. It's also an original IP.

5. Zelda: Link's Awakening
My favorite Zelda. Best of what I liked about the NES and SNES titles, plus it finally let you swap the sword for another weapon. A bit more light-hearted, too. And it showed me that the Gameboy could do a game of this caliber. Before this game, I didn't know that the Gameboy could do this kind of adventure. Color version is even better.

6. Wario Ware Twisted
Pretty much covered in the episode. Cool innovation.

7. Metroid Zero Mission
Probably my most controversial pick, since it's a remake of a console game, and I don't like putting console games in my portables list. But it isn't just a retread, either. New bosses, new areas, and new surprises everywhere. Probably the best of the 2-D Metroids.

8. Final Fantasy Adventure
The first Zelda-style game on the original Gameboy. Not at all like the regular series. Kind of went under the radar for a while until people started realizing that it was the predecessor to the Secret Of Mana.

9. Defenders of Oasis
My other hardcore RPG choice, and my only Game Gear pick. I don't look upon Game Gear fondly, but this was pretty good.

10. SNK Gal Fighter
because it's awesome, and Neo Geo Pocket deserves love.

A few other honorable mentions: TMNT: Fall of the Foot Clan, Final Fantasy Tactics Advance, most any portable Zelda, Castlevania Aria Of Sorrow, Final Fantasy Legend II, Wade Hixton's Counter Punch, the Wario Land series, Sonic Advance, Advance Wars, Kirby's Dreamland 2, and Super Mario Land.

Tried to keep it varied, but there isn't much outside of a Nintendo portable that I can truly say I enjoyed. Game Gear especially.

Ya, that's a good list. And keep in mind we do try to include games from multiple systems unless we decide to designate a top-10 for a specific system (which we will still be doing over the next year). But the GB/GBA def have the best games. I actually just picked up Golden Sun, Metroid Zero Mission, TMNT Fall of the Foot Clan, Sonic Adance and Wade Hixtons Counter Punch in the past month or so - all awesome games for sure! So I have lots of portable gaming to catch up on.

[miner2049er]

You guys should have a one-game-per-franchise rule.

No because you would be forced into missing one that might deserve to be in.


Also, why was UK Mike referring to Super Mario Land 2 as Super Mario Bros. 2? Luigi isn't in that game.

Yeah, I noticed that when editing, I think I did it a couple of times. I also mixed up a Zelda game too I think.


My other hardcore RPG choice

I would not put an RPG in my own handheld list at all, the idea of a handheld for me is dip in and dip out. That doesn't work well with an RPG. If you play a handheld for hours on end, fine. Personally I don't so I don't get into too many RPGs on it.

[readboy]

Just a quick shout out for my favourite hand held game. It's for the GBA and is called Astro Boy The Omega Factor. It's written by Treasure and you guys really should check it out, emulate it if you have to, it just has to be played.

[GameGavel]

Just a quick shout out for my favourite hand held game. It's for the GBA and is called Astro Boy The Omega Factor. It's written by Treasure and you guys really should check it out, emulate it if you have to, it just has to be played.

Yep, it is another great Treasure title.

[TV's Mr. Neil]

No because you would be forced into missing one that might deserve to be in.
I don't think so. At most I would allow two. I can't think of any series that is so great that it deserves to have three of its titles in a top ten, including Mario.


I would not put an RPG in my own handheld list at all, the idea of a handheld for me is dip in and dip out. That doesn't work well with an RPG.
Except the ones that allow you to save anywhere. It's no more a problem for an RPG than it would be for Zelda.

Besides, look at the games that were suggested. Super Mario Land? There's no dip-in-dip-out in that game. You start it and play to the end. At best, it takes a good twenty minutes to get through the game. And there's no save feature. Most RPG sessions would be a fraction of that.

[Gordon Bennett]

Activision Anthology is a fantastic, wonderful cartridge. Not just for the games, but for the interface, the extras, and all of the love put into it. I disagree with its inclusion solely because it is a collection of games instead of a single game - but at the same time I see the need for it. I don't think I have ever seen a full-on, disc based collection that comes close.

As for my personal picks, for those interested:

The Fish Files for GBC. A full, proper, entertaining point and click adventure for the Game Boy Colour. Marvelous. There was simply nothing like it that would fit in the palm of your hand, and it looks spectacular.

The Sims Bustin Out for Nokia N-Gage. If you have ever wondered if you would ever find anyone who actually likes the N-Gage, you have finally found one. This game took the basic mechanics of the Sims and added characters, an actual storyline with development, and hidden games to play on your in-game mobile in a sort of postmodern twist.

Animal Crossing Wild World on the DS. Granted, the DS is far too new and doesn't belong on a retro list - but it is cartridge-based. Call it a future classic if you like. Animal Crossing has so much to offer in that little cartridge, it's astounding.

Blue Lightning on the Lynx. It was After Burner. Except it was in your hand. OK, both of your hands. The Lynx was huge. It was still a portable After Burner, and if no one was looking you could rock from side to side while playing to bring a very sad and pitiful version of the arcade hydraulics home.

[teknohed]

Just got done listening to this one today. First off, I have to say this.

When I got a Game Gear the pack in game was Columns, which was a great game and sadly was beat out by a bunch of predictable mario games.

So Cal I gotta agree with your take on this being sort of "commercial" (not sure if that's the right word) but I was like really another mario game? Sheesh. I think it should have been Mario World in everything else out. There are so many great hand held games and it seems sort of lame to have so many that are basically the same thing up at the top.

Scott, I'm sort of suprised you didn't include the metroid or sonic pinball games. Both of those were great fun I thought.

I also think it's a shame that no one included some of the great castlevania games that have appeared on handhelds, or come to think of it, Pokemon. I'm no pokemaniac, but a handheld game list that doesn't include Pokemon is kind of missing the point.

Other than those gripes it was solid list and a rousing debate as usual. The top tens are fast becoming my favorite part of the show, at least hte part that compel me to come bitch on the forums the most.

[GameGavel]

Just got done listening to this one today. First off, I have to say this.

When I got a Game Gear the pack in game was Columns, which was a great game and sadly was beat out by a bunch of predictable mario games.

So Cal I gotta agree with your take on this being sort of "commercial" (not sure if that's the right word) but I was like really another mario game? Sheesh. I think it should have been Mario World in everything else out. There are so many great hand held games and it seems sort of lame to have so many that are basically the same thing up at the top.

Scott, I'm sort of suprised you didn't include the metroid or sonic pinball games. Both of those were great fun I thought.

I also think it's a shame that no one included some of the great castlevania games that have appeared on handhelds, or come to think of it, Pokemon. I'm no pokemaniac, but a handheld game list that doesn't include Pokemon is kind of missing the point.

Other than those gripes it was solid list and a rousing debate as usual. The top tens are fast becoming my favorite part of the show, at least hte part that compel me to come bitch on the forums the most.

If you are compelled to come in here and bitch about our picks then we are doing our job :)

[Troglodyte]

If you are compelled to come in here and bitch about our picks then we are doing our job :)
LOL... Truly epic reply there :DKB